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03 April 2009 @ 11:37 pm
2x21 ADAM RAISED A CAIN  
Official Episode Discussion Post
2x21 ADAM RAISED A CAIN

Episode Description:

John is one step closer to catching Weaver while on his mission to rescue Skynet's latest target. Sarah and Ellison's reunion causes a change in their plan. Weaver discovers Ellison's secret.



**Hope it's alright that I started the discussion. I figured since it's been a couple hours since it aired, it would be appropriate.
 
 
 
Shalzhen'Ji: sarah connorshalzhenji on April 4th, 2009 03:44 am (UTC)
Holy...

I don't quite know what to say about this episode. I really can't believe about Derek. It just... happened too damn fast.

Thoughts?
Rafiki, the crazy baboonirony_rocks on April 4th, 2009 03:45 am (UTC)
No thoughts.

Just stunned into silence, and wtf? It was so random and sudden.
Shalzhen'Ji: sarah connorshalzhenji on April 4th, 2009 03:49 am (UTC)
It's almost ridiculous. He was a main character, and he gets a "boom dead" death scene? It almost doesn't make sense.

Granted I kinda like the idea of it just being John and Cameron, and seeing what happens with that, but it was so sudden and strange to just "bam!" kill Derek like that :/
Rafiki, the crazy baboon: Slap my mindirony_rocks on April 4th, 2009 03:55 am (UTC)
I think if it was John and Cameron show, this thing would go downhill so fast, it'd be like watching a trainwreck. The reason why is because a show is more than about two characters. SCC already had a small cast, and they really couldn't afford to kill off Derek. Plus, the show is called The Sarah Connor Chronicles, so there's no way they'd ever kill her. 24 had the same problem, and then they tried desperately to fix it this season by magically resurrecting dead people.

This show just jumped shark. Big time.


Edited at 2009-04-04 03:56 am (UTC)
Shalzhen'Ji: sarah connorshalzhenji on April 4th, 2009 04:22 am (UTC)
I wasn't saying just about them. Just the idea that it'd just be them together, without Sarah around to constantly get on Cameron's case, etc.

And, really, who knows what they can do about resurrecting characters. Since it deals in the whole time travel thing, there's a lot of possibilities. I don't know if it's jumped the shark, but it might be harder for them to get renewed. Then again, it's been like that for a while.
(Deleted comment)
ed_84ed_84 on April 4th, 2009 04:54 am (UTC)
Jumped shark? Totally. It killed off how many character in the last few weeks?

It's like watching a trainwreck lately. Yeah, it's made a few good eps, but what now?
(Deleted comment)
vik⋅tor⋅e⋅uh: tscc 'john/cameron-ifipretendyourenotsoutherncharmfa on April 9th, 2009 06:00 am (UTC)
ITA. While I would have preferred it not be Derek, on shows like this main characters have to die or you start to feel like the basic premise is pointless. As much as I love Lost, it started to feel silly after a while when they tried to tell viewers someone might die...when no one ever did. Making a move like this at least gives the show some serious writing cred, though they might lost BAG's fans now :(
indie: SCC Sarah/Derek le sighindiefic on April 4th, 2009 03:53 am (UTC)
I am completely torn between thinking it was the most brilliant bit of television I've ever seen and wanting to tear my eyes out with grief because I love Derek so much.

I'm completely conflicted. And I really, really hope the idea of parallel universes and string theory and general T:SCC minfuckery is going to come into play and give us another iteration of Derek that can be part of the Connor clan. (and explain the timeline continuity problems from "Alpine Fields")

But mostly, I think he's dead and I want to cry.
(Deleted comment)
M.: [T: TSCC] sarahhellandbliss on April 4th, 2009 07:58 am (UTC)
I have no words to express how I feel right now about Derek's death. It was so... random, sudden and anticlimactic. He was one of the best thing that happened to the show, and yet, he had barely been utilized. This character had so much potential... :(

I don't know if TPTB had planned this all along, or if this was a recent decision... I'm really sad that Derek/Sarah paring is now literally dead.
Stephanie: TSCC  S/Deinaphets on April 4th, 2009 02:34 pm (UTC)
:( Yeah, that sums it up for me. They barely used him which was a bad choice. He had surprising screen presence.

I wonder two things:

1. If they know the series is not going to be renewed and want to go out with a bang, OR

2. Green wasn't happy with his role and wanted out.



Either way, I am way bummed. I lost an OTP on BSG this month already and now this. *sniff*
Shalzhen'Ji: sarah connorshalzhenji on April 4th, 2009 07:20 pm (UTC)
So I watched the episode again. It still seems like it happened entirely too fast, but what I came to realize that bugs me more is that Sarah didn't even seem to care.

Hell, even Cameron reacted to the site, seeming to be a bit surprised and even a tad sad (for a terminator). I almost wish the next episode wasn't the finale, I feel like there should have been at least some point in time for Sarah get actually have a chance to grieve over the loss of ANOTHER Reese boy.

It just, killed me that only John, Cameron, and Savannah seemed to react to it. Even when Sarah told Ellison, he didn't seem phased about her naming who'd died until she said Charley. All that build up with Derek to die so quickly and then barely get mentioned for the rest of the episode.

I think they could have done better with this episode in that regard.
The evil ticklerstaceyface on April 4th, 2009 07:47 pm (UTC)
Thank you for starting this thread.

I just can't believe he's gone. But it's almost as if it was foreshadowed. Remember when John was talking to Derek and he asked about Cameron. And Derek's reply was:

"Is she wants me dead, i'm dead"

If a terminator wants him dead, then he is dead. Still, I'm just heartbroken. He was my favorite character and I was completely angry that there was no reaction from Sarah. He made a mistake and she doesn't flinch when he's gone?

Even after that though, I feel like he's not dead. I want to desperately believe that he's coming back, that it wasn't him who died, but I know I'm just being desperate.

R.I.P future flashforwards and glimpses of real and not halluncination Kyle
R.I.P Sarah/Derek ship
R.I.P Derek Reese
Shalzhen'Ji: sarah connorshalzhenji on April 4th, 2009 09:55 pm (UTC)
I started thinking about this. And I'm wondering if we may get another Derek. The whole future thing may apply. I mean, we kept seeing flashes of him in the future with Jesse, and found out that her future was different which means there may yet still be a Derek Reese.

Let us cross our fingers for another season, because then that leaves plenty of options for bringing him back, hopefully.
forceiswithyou: TSCC;;Cameron Come with meforceiswithyou on April 6th, 2009 11:07 pm (UTC)
I found his death upsetting, actually, by its very realism. Violence is fast, ruthless. No one explains. There are no close ups. He died as quickly, as shudderingly abruptly as people do in real mortal, life or death situations.

However I'm not sure the show is that smart, lol, so maybe Brian Green was just like, 'I'M DONE.'

I'm kind of sad about it. I just haven't been able to wrap my mind around it really because it happened soooo fast and he was such a main I do kind of wonder if they're going to write the series somehow to have him turn up again. I'd never really considered it, because I'm not much into the show's fandom, but of course everyone on this page discussing alternate temporal realities and seperate versions of Derek is talking about something the show can and has used. Interesting.
vik⋅tor⋅e⋅uh: tscc 'john/cameron-ifipretendyourenotsoutherncharmfa on April 9th, 2009 06:04 am (UTC)
I just rewatched the episode, because I'm still a little bit in shock I think, I'm starting to think that maybe he will come back, or he would in a future season. It would really make a lot of sense given the time-continuity issues raised in "Alpine Fields", and just the way Brian Austin Green has really enthusiastically been saying lately that TSCC will always be his priority makes me wonder if even he is hoping to make a return. But that might just be my wishful thinking.